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And "they" dare to mock us when we talked about "hope and change." Here is a prime example:
Obama to overturn Bush policy on stem cells
WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama is allowing federal taxpayer dollars to fund embryonic stem cell research, the latest reversal of his predecessor's policies.
The president, who plans to sign an order later Monday, will be fulfilling a campaign promise that could set in motion a broad push on research to find better treatment for ailments from diabetes to paralysis. Proponents such as former first lady Nancy Reagan and the late actor Christopher Reeve had called for ending restrictions on research spending.
The executive order undoes former President George W. Bush's directive that was based on his determination that using embryos to create additional stem cell lines was morally wrong and, therefore, research on those lines should not be funded by the government.
Bush had limited the use of taxpayer money to 21 stem cell lines that were created before Aug. 9, 2001. The Obama order reverses that but does not address a legislative ban that precludes any federal money to researchers who develop stem cell lines by destroying embryos.
The legislation, however, does not prevent funds for research on stem cell lines that were produced by researchers who did their work without federal aid.
Bush and his supporters had said they were defending human life. Days-old embryos — typically from fertility clinics and destined for destruction — are destroyed for the stem cells.
Embryonic stem cells are master cells that can morph into any cell of the body. Scientists hope to harness them so they can create replacement tissues to treat a variety of diseases — such as new insulin-producing cells for diabetics, cells that could help those with Parkinson's disease or maybe even Alzheimer's, or new nerve connections to restore movement after spinal injury.
In reversing the Bush policy, Obama also planned to issue a memo on scientific research in an East Room ceremony. White House advisers said the memorandum was part of the president's policy of deeper scientific involvement in issues ranging from renewable energy to climate change.
"I would simply say this memorandum is not concerned solely — or even specifically — with stem cell research," said Harold Varmus, chairman of the White House's Council of Advisers on Science and Technology. He said it would address how the government uses science and who is advising officials across federal agencies.
But Rep. Eric Cantor, the No. 2 Republican in the House, said the White House should focus on the economy, not on a long-simmering debate over stem cells.
"Frankly, federal funding of embryonic stem cell research can bring on embryo harvesting, perhaps even human cloning that occurs," he said Sunday on CNN's "State of the Union." "We don't want that. ... And certainly that is something that we ought to be talking about, but let's take care of business first. People are out of jobs."
Regardless, researchers say newer lines that have been produced without federal money during the period of the Bush ban are healthier and better suited to creating treatment for diseases.
"We've got eight years of science to make up for," said Dr. Curt Civin, whose research allowed scientists to isolate stem cells and who now serves as the founding director of the University of Maryland Center for Stem Cell Biology and Regenerative Medicine.
At the same event Monday, Obama planned to announce safeguards through the National Institutes of Health intended to diminish what the administration believes is an intrusion by the political process on the scientific community.
"We view what happened with stem cell research in the last administration is one manifestation of failure to think carefully about how federal support of science and the use of scientific advice occurs," Varmus said.
ANY QUESTIONS?????
posted by Gordon Glantz at
8:40 AM
56 Comments:
Here's a question, you liberal scumbag, what about the sanctity of human life?
And dub-yah was concerned about the sanctity of human life by starting an unnecessary war? He's the criminal, not Obama.
Research should not be paid for with Taxpayers money period. TB and Polio are two examples that did not have the Federal Government fighting for funds. If a person wishes to donate any part (including muscles)or fluid to research that is their business and should be placed in writing and legally witnessed so there would be no doubt of their intention. Just because one person thinks a procedure is OK, does not mean we all should get on the bandwagon. We have way too many medicines that now keep us alive,but only with the help of caregivers. Now, thinking on that part we are now calling for a very costly health care package.
We had three (3) unnecessary wars if you want to get into who,when,why & how all the wars we had since the 1917. Did the wars make you feel more safe here in PA? Well, quite a few neighbors can show you the scars (physical) or (mental) that still remain. We do not talk about them but I'm sure when it comes down to using humans again to experiment as did many Governments we would all agree Government must stay out of Medical Research.
Three cheers for Obama!
Hooray for the devaluation of human life! Obama has reduced us to nothing more than the sum of our genetic material, which, of course, is what liberals always thought we were anyway--just a mere accident away from a fate as primordial ooze.
I'm feeling more hopeful than ever!
Q: What would happen to the embryos used in stem cell research if they weren't used to advance medical science?
A:The "embryos" -- really just fertilized human egg cells, commonly known as blastocysts -- are from invitro clinics and are unused "extras" no longer needed by donors and OK'd for this use. If not used by scientists, these cells would be incinerated and destroyed.
Q: But right-to-lifers think that's OK?
A: Apparently it's OK to burn them up, just don't use them to save real people.
Lisa,
If Ann Coulter took steroids, she would be you. I don't mean that as a compliment either.
Jen
Q. When is MPD going to volunteer what is commonly known as "blastocysts" made of his own genetic material for stem cell testing?
Q. Who owns what is commonly known as "blastocysyts" once they have been created? The donors of the genetic material, or should the federal government now be able to mandate that you must use them for stem cell research?
Lisa, are you really that dense or do you just play it that way on the Internet?
Do you really, truly believe that the Big Bad Government marches into in-vitro clinics and commandeers all the stem cells they can cart away?
Of course it doesn't happen that way. There's something called "informed consent" and there are, of course, specific and very precise legal forms that patients can choose to fill out, sign and agree to before any use is ever made of their "donations."
And I'd be more than happy to donate some for science. If little microscopic potential MPDs will help cure cancer and give some sick kid a chance at living a full life, I'm thrilled to do it. Sign me up.
So MPD, explain to me exactly how this great Obama policy that you elucidated above is different than the policy we had under Bush.
I already know the answer. I just want to see you put it into words.
Oh, and I'm very pleased to see your bravado in donating your "genetic material". I personally can't think of a better use for it. However, I hope the other half of that equation--you know the person who donates the egg (commonly referred to as a "mother") is as enthusiastic as you are.
Lisa, I didn't "elucidate" -- or even talk about -- an Obama policy. I believe Gordon did that; you might want to play your little quizmaster schtick with him.
I explained about how a clinic would handle fertilized eggs used in stem cell research. I guess it's hard for you to follow the conversation when adults are talking.
Who is in charge before changes are made,right?? If the Federal Government will be using our "Taxpayers" money to fund embryonic stem cell or any other research he is planning within this package, we need to know who,why,when,where and for what reason exactly. Prior planning is truly needed during the planning stage before funding is given- not after. Government should not get into this too deeply. It will all end up in the courts and what was supposed to be a great promise for the cure of some many illnesses will fail. I know Pres. Obama has a great "Wish List" for this country of ours, but he needs to give himself more time and think things through before just taking advice from people surrounding him as gospel. Haste makes Waste!
What a pathetic, cowardly little cop-out artist you are, MPD. But that shouldn't surprise me; your standard MO usually includes one or more of the following strategies: evade, misdirect, accuse your opponent of using the very same tactics you are using (except when you accuse your opponent, it usually includes a whine about how unfair it is), but this is a new one: Leave the heavy lifting to Gordon.
Let's remind the group of MPD's original post:
Q: What would happen to the embryos used in stem cell research if they weren't used to advance medical science?
A:The "embryos" -- really just fertilized human egg cells, commonly known as blastocysts -- are from invitro clinics and are unused "extras" no longer needed by donors and OK'd for this use. If not used by scientists, these cells would be incinerated and destroyed.
Q: But right-to-lifers think that's OK?
A: Apparently it's OK to burn them up, just don't use them to save real people.
Now did Bush actually prevent people from donating those embryos, as you imply in this post?
If not, what's the point of your post? Just to trash people in your typical petty mean spirited way for having the audacity to think that the "parents" of the "blastocysyts" should be the ones who decide the fate of their own genetic material?
And of course, as always, should they make the wrong "choice" (according to you) they should be vilified for not advancing the cause of this "science" which has produced absolutely nothing.
Indeed, if it was so promising, it wouldn't need to be propped up by government funding. But, yeah, I'm the one who can't follow along when adults are talking.
Anonymous said...
Here's a question, you liberal scumbag, what about the sanctity of human life?
March 9, 2009 10:05 AM
Well, well, here's another santimoneous pompous right-wing loon spewing nonsense. The stem cells would be discarded down a drain, and what about human suffering? You are just like Rush aka Oxycontin druggie-draft dodging because of a pimple on his rear Limbaugh who insulted the handicapped/disabled people like Michael J. Fox, by accusing him of flailing his arms on purposed. You, like the doughboy on steroids, would kick a person if they fell out of their wheel chair. Human life as you want to preach is just the same rhetoric that came from the pedophile priests and Mark Foley and Larry Craig who spouted their opposition to child abuse, while carrying out crimes against children and some adults. Take a hike, loser, your party of repukelicraps lost, because I, along with others, were tired of the trickle down theory not working... only seemed like warm yellow snow!
Anonymous said...
We had three (3) unnecessary wars if you want to get into who,when,why & how all the wars we had since the 1917. Did the wars make you feel more safe here in PA? Well, quite a few neighbors can show you the scars (physical) or (mental) that still remain. We do not talk about them but I'm sure when it comes down to using humans again to experiment as did many Governments we would all agree Government must stay out of Medical Research.
March 9, 2009 12:24 PM
----------------
You don't represent all of the people serving in the ARMED FORCES! There are a lot of them who are against president-select Bush's policies of restrictions on stem cell research and his stupid insistence of abstinence programs, which Bristol Palin said wouldn't work. Bush also manipulated the scientists' reports on global warming, so when you are flooded by the oceans, don't complain. Just keep your mouth shut!
Lisa said...
Hooray for the devaluation of human life! Obama has reduced us to nothing more than the sum of our genetic material, which, of course, is what liberals always thought we were anyway--just a mere accident away from a fate as primordial ooze.
I'm feeling more hopeful than ever!
March 10, 2009 4:34 AM
---------------
And here we have the cartoon charactor, lisa mossie, who is Ann Coulter in disguise. You are contributing to the global warming crisis everything you open your mouth. Waste of paper, too. Do everyone a favor and hook your mouth up to a regeneration plant to power some houses. I said it before, and I will say it again, you and the other loons need to mind your own business! YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO DETERMINE WHAT I DO WITH MY BODY!!!!!!!!!!! And, as I was surfing the channels and happened to come across some so-called educational channel, featuring Times Herald columnists, and heard you mention my prior comment and my being an enemy, you put yourself up on a pedestal with that stupid remark! I recognize you as another disciple of Rush the drug addict hypocrite Limbaugh and my comment was just that. You are not the enemy, just a hot-air balloon like Failin' Palin. You betcha, wink, wink and a nose scrunchie shout-out to earmarks like the $25 million road to nowhere earmark, that you and other Republican leaning hypocrites failed to talk about when you attack Democrats.
everything you open your mouth.
Correction, that should be "hot-air global warming, Everytime lisa mossie opens her mouth!"
Blogger Lisa said...
So MPD, explain to me exactly how this great Obama policy that you elucidated above is different than the policy we had under Bush.
I already know the answer. I just want to see you put it into words.
Oh, and I'm very pleased to see your bravado in donating your "genetic material". I personally can't think of a better use for it. However, I hope the other half of that equation--you know the person who donates the egg (commonly referred to as a "mother") is as enthusiastic as you are.
March 11, 2009 3:50 AM
I just so happen to be a WOMAN and I see no problems in donating to help stem cell research help HUMAN BEINGS! So, get of your hobby horse and get a life lisa mossie. You waste precious space in the newspaper, which harms the spotted owl, and I'd rather have a spotted owl in the news than you.
Lisa said...
What a pathetic, cowardly little cop-out artist you are, MPD.
YOU are the coward, hiding behind a stupid column full of merde! You are the pathetic cartoon character who wants to be like those other lunatics, like Rush Limbaugh, Failin' Palin and Ann Coulter. Why don't you change that childish Speed Racer icon to a porky earmark icon? I voted for change and so did millions of other people. You just want Obama to fail like that drug addict Limbaugh. So, why don't you admit it! You are just a chicken, like the K K K, hiding behind their sheets! And, don't go saying that I don't know what I'm talking about as I had a so-called teacher in Montgomery County wear his sheets to work. And this was not very long ago, just like the recent event during the construction in Philadelphia where a nut brought a noose in to threaten a man, just because of his race! Your stupid scare tactics are boring, just like president-select bush. People didn't like his spending $10 billion a MONTH to benefit the cardiac kid's company and they voted against McSAME! Stop reading between the lines, your party of losers LOST!
"...your standard MO usually includes one or more of the following strategies: evade, misdirect, accuse your opponent of using the very same tactics you are using (except when you accuse your opponent, it usually includes a whine about how unfair it is)..."
Lisa, I think you have me confused with Tony Phyrillas or Stan Huskey. Either that or you've been listening to those voices in your head again.
Get well soon.
MPD: You are a cowardly cop-out king. Your response isn't even clever. If you don't know the answer, at least have the guts to say so.
For the rest of you oh-so-brave anonymous posters who think that insulting me personally equates to intelligent and effective debate, get this straight once and for all: The Bush Administration NEVER banned stem cell research. They simply limited the amount of federal funding available to it. There have been absolutely NO LIMITATIONS placed on PRIVATE funding. All your savior Obama has done was promise that the federal government will fund the research.
Wow.
He's awesome.
As if stem cell research will somehow yield something other than tumors if only we can fund it with tax payer money instead of private funding. Oh, and lets not forget that they've been doing stem cell research ALL OVER THE WORLD for years without those so-called draconian restrictions that Bush placed on them here in the U.S. and that research has yielded...oh, that's right. Tumors.
The only stem cell research that has actually yielded results is that from adult stem cell research and pluripotent stem cell research, both of which do not destroy human life, which Obama has promised to DE-fund.
But I can see clearly that simpletons like yourselves cannot be bothered to make minor distinctions like this; it's much more satisfying to indulge your irrational anger from the anonymous comfort of your own home. Because destroying human life in the name of "science" paves the way for making abortion legitmate and ultimately, altruistic. Which is the ultimate goal of this whole argument.
Why do you attach so much value to your own lives when you are so willing to destroy others for the sake of it?
Hard questions, I know. But I don't expect you to think. I expect you to keep hurling insults and repeating your liberal talking points, because that's what you do; thinking makes your head hurt. The facts are out there, but apparently are as difficult for sheepy liberals to look up as signing a real name to a post on a blog.
Why do you attach so much value to your own lives when you are so willing to destroy others for the sake of it?
OAKS, PA -- Local resident Lisa Mossie today announced the formation of a new embryonic rights organization, the BLA (for Blastocyst Liberation Army), which will campaign for a full range of rights to be awarded to what Mossie calls "our microscopic citizens."
"How can you be so heartless as to sacrifice these tiny little humans for some silly science experiment," Mossie said."These aren't just cells -- they're my friends."
Mossie called for extending the right to vote to these so-called "laboratory-Americans."
"I know for a fact that if we had simply counted the billions of embryo votes last November, we would be basking in the glory of President John McCain right now," Mossie said.
A crowd of several thousand blastocysts, gathered in a nearby petri dish for the announcement, had no comment.
What I don't get is why Lisa Mossie is piggy-backing on Gordon's Blog? Doesn't she have her own blog nobody visits?
The hate and vitrol spewed by this person is even more offensive given the fact she gets over a foot of ink, unchallenged, once a week in the paper.
Exactly how much of this person's opinion are we to be subjected ?
Joe --
She's got a big ego, a big mouth, a dark heart and an empty head. Bad combination there. But one she shares with so many other wingers who've been propped up on a platform supplied by the corporate-owned media: Limbaugh, Hannity...Phyrillas.
--MPD
Oh hi, Joe the Nerd--are you here to apologize to me for falsely accusing me of treating ARC protestors with "derision", or just here to spread more mis-information?
You act like you are "subjected": to my opinion in the Herald every week, like it's some sort of hardship you are tortured with against your will, when it is abundantly clear that either a.) you don't read my column, since you ascribe to me opinions that are not mine, or b.) that my column's reading level is just beyond your reading comprehension level.
As usual, any opinion different from yours is one opinion too many and must be silenced, since to actually debate would result in your losing. So sorry for interrupting your little liberal baby killing love fest with an opposing point of view--I know how inconvenient and uncomfortable it can be for liberals when they have to actually consider morality in their thinking.
So tell you what, why don't you all just continue to evade addressing any of the points I brought up above and pretend that your insults are so terrifically witty and powerful that they have actually made your point.
Gee, no wonder the parent company is going bankrupt. Witj the likes of Lisa in the TH, who would want to waste 75 cents? Why do conservative bloggers have this god-like fetish that only they know the truth? Your way has ruined this country. Pompousity, thy name is Lisa, the lawgiver. Funny how conservatives want to protect the "unborn", but don't give a crap about the born, unless they have lots of money. Or their daughter is pregnant.
The unused embryos in fertility clincs will be discarded as trash. Might as well put them to good use as they are not, nor will they ever be babies. Lisa, why not put your money where your mouth is: be like the octo-mom and have several of these soon-to-be-discarded embryos implanted in yourself.
Hey Lisa,
Why don't you addressed the real loss of human life in Iraq???
I bey you avoid answering that question the way Nerd Boy avoids answering yours.
Kimmie
AP report:
Catholic bishops outspoken
Catholic bishops have been outspoken in opposing embryonic stem cell research. Other Catholics, though, are more open to lifting the Bush-era restrictions, with caveats. The Rev. Tom Reese, a senior fellow at the Woodstock Theological Center at Georgetown University, said restrictions should be put on embryonic stem cell research — including prohibition on their buying and selling, and using only embryos that otherwise would be destroyed.
"I'm trying to make an argument for some middle ground here," Reese said. "Hopefully down the line we can reach a point where we don't have to use embryonic stem cell research."
Polls show some believers are willing to buck their leaders on the issue. Fifty-nine percent of white, non-Hispanic Catholics and 58 percent of white mainline Protestants favor embryonic stem cell research, according to a poll released in July 2008 by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. Only 31 percent of white evangelical Protestants, however, favored the research.
full of hot air lisa mossie doth protests: "For the rest of you oh-so-brave anonymous posters who think that insulting me personally"
Then the windbag starts up with her insults:
What a pathetic, cowardly little cop-out artist you are, MPD.
and again:
What a pathetic, cowardly little cop-out artist you are, MPD.
and the typical religious insult:
All your savior Obama has done was promise that the federal government will fund the research.
and again:
But I can see clearly that simpletons like yourselves
and again:
The facts are out there, but apparently are as difficult for sheepy liberals to look up as signing a real name to a post on a blog.
and again:
that my column's reading level is just beyond your reading comprehension level.
and again:
So sorry for interrupting your little liberal baby killing love fest with an opposing point of view--I know how inconvenient and uncomfortable it can be for liberals when they have to actually consider morality in their thinking.
-------------------------
So, after reading lisa- aka ann coulter in disguise- mossie, I agree with the people you call your enemies, opposition, etc., that you need to take your ball and go home to your own blog that few people, except the right wing loons, visit. You are just jealous that you are known as a (and, I will modify your own words)oxycontin-limbaugh worshiper. You need to stop pushing your so-called religion and questionable morality on others!
----------------------
Also, as you want to cry about people not using their names, tell your "fearless leader" Stan to get his minions to fix the site as I have tried to register several times and never received an email confirmation. For a paper "serving" the community, the registration process is the worse one that I have ever seen. I have registered with ABC, Newsvine, and a lot of other news websites without the overbearing requirement of having to put a lot of information on this website.
Kimmie:
Which "real loss of human life in Iraq" would you like me to address? U.S. soldiers, who volunteered to put themselves in harm's way to defend our freedoms, the terrorist groups who invaded Iraq to make their stand against the U.S., who also volunteered to put themselves in harms way to fight for their beliefs, the innocents that were killed because the terrorists used them as human shields, or the thousands of Kurds and Iraqis that were killed by Saddam before we liberated Iraq?
Boy, Lisa, you are sad. You really have it twisted. I think they call it pretzel logic. How many people would be alive today if we hadn't invaded Iraq for reasons that still aren't clear. I mean ... honey, really ... to defend our freedoms? LOL! Do they have rehab clinics for people like you?
Oh, I guess that cartoon character lisa was there in Iraq when everyone was killed, so she has the real story. NOT!
Why are Vets speaking out about president-select bush's illegal oil war and running against Republicans when they come home from this oil/no-bid contracts to benefit Cheney war? Boy, are your blinders on tight! Standard issue from Rush, huh?
Who has blinders on??? Taxpayers are more willing to pay for most research done without seeing results within the tube. But, as one report stated ... Results so far is from Adult Stem Cell and Pluripotent Stem Cell Research,... that do not detroy Human Life, which Obama has promised to DE-Fund...interesting!!... Maybe a little more thought should go into OBama's decisions in this case and also that on AIG, before we get deeper in debt without cause. His spokesperson has a hard time defending his decisions at the daily reporting sessions with the news reporters. Well, maybe a Weekly Report would be better by O'Bama and his most embarassed Spokesperson on so many decisions that are being looked into --- HINDSITE...the need to blame everything on the former administration is really getting OLD because of the lack of another phrase to justify their decisions. If OBama is going to Govern - he must take on all the fault/praise from here on.
Embarrasing! Why? Wasn't it refreshing to have our former PRESIDENT (dub-yah) state his belief regarding the sanctity of human life. Now we are willing to do away with parts that we dislike and continue on our merry way with any part that we feel comfortable with, although it could become out of control very shortly with Federal Gov. Funding. This whole bill is not all about Stem Cell, but this is one part that needs to be refined.
Lisa,
No apology necessary, thank you.
My point is: how much exposure do you want and aren’t you being greedy about it.
I have to say that you know so little about me that you would state that I would limit opinion. I have no problem with difference of opinion, only the disregard of facts. In fact I like it when someone can legitimately challenge me off a position.
I have read your columns, aside from the fact that less is more when editing (that’s not really your problem since you are a beginner, your editor should be a better guide for you), some of your points are totally off base.
As with your DDT tirade, the issue with DDT isn’t with human consumption and exposure, but it is as much about what DDT does to the lower levels of the food chain. Why not ask a local apiculturist about the issues they have been having lately and multiply those issues into developing agricultures. DDT will kill that industry before it gets off the ground. But you have all the facts about politicizing science. What is your degree in again? Sportscasting?
As for baby-killing – where the hell do you get off accusing anyone with murder? Who appointed you judge of anything? What facts are you using to accuse me? Your tirades expose you as a complete whack-job.
I don’t consider myself a liberal, but a moderate. I can see more than one facet of an issue. I can even do it without using the talking points from the RNC. Excuse me, but what are your qualifications for being a moralist?
As for me being somehow witty, I already did so well as a stand-up comic that I went into computers. The power in my thoughts comes from a couple of semesters of Logic in the Philosophy Department at Temple U. from a guy named Professor Wisdom. ( I still have the text book he wrote on the subject.)
Because I don’t visit here every day doesn’t mean that I walked away from something; it means I have a life. You should try to get one.
Joe the Nerd,
First of all, as usual, you accuse me of things I did not say. It was your "moderate" pal Kimmie who said you avoid the fight. I've been waiting patiently for your return, because you are one of two posters on this blog that actually has a pulse (the othe being TLees).
That being said, you are aware that life begins at conception, right? That point has not been disputed for years, regardless of lame attmepts at creating nomenclature to lessen the impact of destroying it (case in point: MPD's use of the word "blastocyst" as if calling it something else makes it something else.). I never said it was "murder" but if the shoe fits....
I made one little innocuous comment about Obama's policies devaluing human life and this board exploded. I daresay Gordon wouldn't be getting as many hits otherwise. Your suggestion that my commenting on blogs is "attention craving" or some other such nonsense is completely ridiculous. I comment on many many blogs when I find something worth commenting about. Gordon just hasn't had much to say that interested me lately. I still don't understand why you are so afraid of dissenting opinion; I was not aware that this was a "liberals and 'moderates' only" board. And surely you realize that there are many other people out there who agree with me.
I was not aware that one needed to present "qualifications" to make a stand for what's right against what's reprehensible. If that's the case, since no one is perfect, let's just abandon all pretense at decency and live in anarchy and depravity. After all, we're none of us qualified to judge, are we?
And while I appreciate you posting your resume for me, I'm not exactly sure what I'm supposed to say to that? Congratulations? I'm impressed? What? Does where you went to school or what you do for a living somehow elevate your opinion over mine?
Finally, a word about looking into the mirror, my friend: you may think you that you are somehow more enlightened than us knuckle dragging conservatives simply because of that wonderful, self proclaimed ability see all sides of the issue. Here's a news flash: Everybody thinks that they can see all sides of the issue. Even and especially me. So this tremendous insight you offered after much thoughtful introspection is worth exactly nothing. Remember, sir, you don't know anything about me either, other than what you read in the paper, which is what I choose to reveal.
Lisa,
You are the one who accused me of murder. I take exception to that.
So sorry for interrupting your little liberal baby killing love fest with an opposing point of view--I know how inconvenient and uncomfortable it can be for liberals when they have to actually consider morality in their thinking.
You are the one who is now beyond the pale.
I am interested in your resume because Stan is the one who is touting his highly trained staff of writers, of which you are one.
You don't need special training to have an opinion, that is the right, and responsibility, of every citizen.
However, you are holding forth on a variety of topics. From what perspective do you arrive at these opinions. If I take my car to two garages, one run by a guy with a Vo-Tech certificate and the other with an certification as a Master Mechanic, who's opinion will hold more water?
I am not saying the Vo-Tech guy won't get it right, but I know the Master Mechanic has certifiably put in the time, effort and training to back his opinion.
I don't think I am off-base in asking for your vitae to ponitificate. I am not asking anyone for perfection, but perspective.
I am also challenging your ad homin remarks because it de-values everything else you say. Why should I look for a point in your articles if I am going be insulted while doing it?
How are you going to convince me of anything if you already have two strikes on you because I think you are acting like a j*rk.
Well, Joe, what can I say? I am so dazzled by your incisive argument that you have convinced me to change my whole opinion on the murder of the unborn.
Oh wait. Just kidding.
Let's talk for a minute about ad hominem attacks (or is that "ad homin"? I don't know--I didn't go to college like Joe): Here is Joe I'm-afraid-to-post-my-last-name's entre into the debate on this blog:
"What I don't get is why Lisa Mossie is piggy-backing on Gordon's Blog? Doesn't she have her own blog nobody visits?
The hate and vitrol spewed by this person is even more offensive given the fact she gets over a foot of ink, unchallenged, once a week in the paper.
Exactly how much of this person's opinion are we to be subjected ?"
That seems a bit passive-agressive to me, not to mention the fact that it has absolutely nothing to do with the debate at hand. It also seems--dare I say it?--a bit jealous. But I guess that's how liberals...err...I mean self aware balanced "moderates" argue:
talk about how open minded and balanced you are while complaining about the absolute nerve of someone who would dare to espouse a contrarian opinion to yours.
And now you are snivelling because I answered you in kind. Sorry I hurt your widdle feelings. Here's a tissue, Joey. Dry your eyes.
Is that really the best you've got, Mr. I'm-so-thin-skinned-that-I-get-personally-insulted-by-a-newspaper-columnist? The best argument you can offer is that I'm a "jerk" and that I have not presented my "qualifications" to "pontificate"? Somebody call the opinion police! There's an unqualified poster on the internet!!!!
So answer me this if you can, Joe I'm-afraid-to-post-my-last-name: Since DDT has been proven safe in the interim between "Silent Spring" and now (whether you acknowledge it or not), and since you are so concerned about three parts-per-million supposedly destroying entire eco-systems, how many babies would you be willing to kill to find an alternative cure for malaria using embryonic stem cell research? Or is it just ok that poor Africans die by the thousands every year so we don't run the risk of losing a 164th of an inch on the white-throated sparrow's eggs?
Oh and so sorry. For accusing you of having a pulse. I won't make that mistake again.
Hey Joe --
Serves you right for trying to deal with her like a human being. Can't be done, bro. Way too much boiling anger there to ever hold a rational conversation.
Next time, opt for riducule. There's plenty of material and it's much more fun to write.
And welcome to the ranks of the pulse-less. So far there's you, me and the Republican Party.
-- MPD
MPD,
I know what you mean. But this is like batting practice. Get your feet set, dig in, wait for the hanging curve, hold the hands back, follow thru with an easy level swing, and watch it go over the fence.
Lisa just doesn't get the basics of biology and the concept of the food chain. It is pretty simply logic, remove the lower end of the food chain, and you disrupt the whole thing. I agree with her DDT doesn’t affect humans directly, that is of little consequence if we move into Soylent Green mode because the agriculture system has been destroyed.
I think it has to do with the anti-education thing. She, like Sarah Palin, doesn't get that what you read affects how you think. Palin wouldn't answer what she reads in a straightforward manner, then she blamed the questioner. Seems like the same act.
The conclusion that I am coming to is that much of what Stan is saying as editor of the paper doesn't hold water. On one hand he is touting the qualifications of his staff, then on the other, the staff refuses to state how they are qualified to make their judgments. Hmmmm.
One doesn't need to go to college to have an outlook, but getting a degree generally does take some discipline, and a represents a baseline of work product. Whether formally schooled or not, one should be able to recount the experiences they are relying upon to make their observations.
I don’t like to use ridicule; I actually prefer hyperbole, satire, or a sardonic nature. Standard deductive logic trains can be pretty devastating also.
I’d rather be pulse-less than brain-less…
BTW – Surname: Ferraro
Thank you Joe for your very astute comments, especially:
{I think it has to do with the anti-education thing. She, like Sarah Palin, doesn't get that what you read affects how you think. Palin wouldn't answer what she reads in a straightforward manner, then she blamed the questioner. Seems like the same act.}
As one person told me re: a comment about Failin' Palin and her exposing herself as an idiot... That she's a few brain cells short of being an idiot. And the same seems to go for Lisa Mossie, who spews garbage without any evidence, just like Rush Limbaugh and his gang of hypocrites, liars and adulterers. Then we have the Pope saying erroneously that condoms don't prevent AIDS, while on his way to try to recruit people in Africa who are suffering an epidemic due to AIDS! And on top of that it was just reported in Metro that Jenna Jameson is happy to have given birth to twins and is a devout Catholic. I guess that as long as she confesses over and over again after her acts as a porn queen, she is pure as the driven snow. Kind of like the pedophile priests. Maybe that's how the Mafia got over killing, etc., by going to their local Priest and confessing about the murders and doing a few Hail Mary chants and the like... aka Larry Craig, Mark Foley, Henry Hyde, Newt Gingrich...
"Research should not be paid for with Taxpayers money period."
Well, then you shouldn't benefit from this research. You probably think it's okay to put your kids in a private/religious school with taxpayer vouchers, too, while ignoring the people in poorer areas, whose children don't get the same level of education/$ because of where they live. Well, I think the state should divide the education funds equally among all the students. And if the "eggs" are going to be thrown out anyway, what's your point? You and the religious fruitcakes have no point other than trying to force your crap on others.
Research that is funded by the US Government must be to benefit all people. I am not aware of any medical research that is funded by our Government has anything to do with a childs education, unless you feel this money should all go for education. Medical research should start with private funds and when some progress is noted in one area, then Federal Funds should be applied for, not before. That is how I feel about it.
Research jobs of all kinds are now available by most Universities. These are paid positions that most summer part timers fill. So, if you are interested in this type of work, and it is in your field of study, check local Universities. Don't look for outside work that would help you get a tan and Vitamin D, because they have been filled by students from out of the country with work visas or not (don't ask, don't tell). This type of work and the way to posessing one has NOT CHANGED.
From all I read concerning what will be be permitted by our New Obama group is if it is good, fix it. Obama now suggests, let's give it another spin or two until most people agree with the outcome. As for the welcome mat for residents from south of any border, turn the other cheek, every person is welcome and we will take care of you and your children, medically and education too. Now, for Americans (USA) vacationing in any of these countries, do not expect to have any protection by the police. You see they are there for their people only.
Anonymous said...
From all I read concerning what will be be permitted by our New Obama group is if it is good, fix it. Obama now suggests, let's give it another spin or two until most people agree with the outcome. As for the welcome mat for residents from south of any border, turn the other cheek, every person is welcome and we will take care of you and your children, medically and education too.
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Another oxycontin-limbaugh recruit. president-select bush courted the same for the Hispanic vote and condone spying on U.S. citizens. His patriot act was a farce, causing me a problem getting a simple bank account, while illegals were able to cash checks in Norristown by wearing the car-wash company's shirt WITHOUT IDENTIFICATION! The illegal people are here, and I don't like it and I would be labeled by the extremist mossie as a liberal. She, palin, bush, and the rest of the hypocrites would go along with vouchers to have their kids attend private school using taxpayers' money. Well, if all children got the same education, i.e., a U.S. education rather than an education set by states and cities with the wealth ruling the day, then mossie would call it socialism, just like the idiots at the tea parties are "outraged" now, but not at the $10 billion a month spent on an oil war. People showed that they were tired of the Bush crap and showed it at the polls. mossie has shown that she has a fixation on President Obama and like a jealous dog keeps grabbing that old tired thread and goes on like a broken record. Get this mossie! President Obama is not my savior and you insult me and a hell of a lot of other people with your stupidity, i.e., being a puppet for good ole rushie. Bet you have his picture in a "place of honor" at your house. Said it before and will say it again. Take your tired ball and go back to your own blog. Your race baiting tactics are sick and you need to get a life and not in the papers!
Hey Lisa Mossie, where were you when this was going on? Didn't see any outrage at the earmark queen's money for Alaska.
Examples of Alaska earmarks
Posted 8/14/2007 1:56 PM | Comment | Recommend E-mail | Save | Print |
By The Associated Press
Some examples of special project appropriations going to Alaska, as compiled by the private group Taxpayers for Common Sense:
_Alaska Fisheries Marketing Board. From its federal funds, the board gave Alaska Airlines a $500,000 grant. It was used, in part, to paint a Boeing 737 to look like a Chinook Salmon to promote the state's seafood.
_The Alyeska Roundhouse received $450,000. The building is at the Alyeska ski resort in Girdwood, where Alaska Republican Sen. Ted Stevens has his home.
_Money for six "Alternative Salmon Products." The University of Alaska received several of these earmarks, which included $450,000 for development of baby food containing salmon in 2006.
_Alaska Christian College received $435,000 in 2005. The school had several dozen students at the time.
The National Archives and Records Administration received at least $2.25 million toward the purchase of an empty lot in Anchorage from two former Stevens business partners. The purchase cost was $3.5 million, allowing the former Stevens partners to more than double their investment.
_The Alaska Botanical Garden received $300,000 over three years for expansion and renovation.
_SpringBoard, an organization that helps Alaska businesses meet the needs of the Department of Defense, received $14 million the past two years.
_$250,000 was appropriated to plan for the Alaska Statehood celebration, set for 2009.
_$1 million in 2005 went for mobile computers for police cars in Wasilla, Alaska, population 6,700.
by Jason Moore
Wednesday, March 11, 2009
ANCHORAGE, Alaska -- President Barack Obama signed a massive spending bill Wednesday to keep government running, but it's packed with pork.
Obama, who campaigned on earmark reform, signed a bill with about 9,000 earmarks.
Still, it means millions of federal dollars for Alaska projects.
The $410 billion bill was packed with earmarks, but that doesn't mean the president liked it.
"I am signing an imperfect omnibus bill because it's necessary for the ongoing functions of government and we have a lot more work to do," Obama said. "We can't have Congress bogged down at this critical juncture in our economic recovery. But I also view this as a departure point for more far-reaching change."
The bill is not so imperfect for Alaska, with nearly $200 million for sea lion research at the Sealife Center in Seward, harbor improvements in Saint Paul, water and sewer projects in the Bush, and much more.
The Denali Commission will receive $78 million from the bill.
If Nancy Pelosi, Speaker of the House, has her way she will tell our President to ... Just sign it President ... We can't have congress bogged down at this critical juncture in our economic recovery... What she would be referring to was "Windfall Tax on Retirement Income"... We need to work toward the goal of equalizing income. This tax would be spent?? Raise the standards of the poor, minorities that are unemployed. Will this also help support the millions of illegal immigrants too? Oh, just sign it Mr. President, we will work out details as we go along. Another change!
Higher Education has always varied State by State. That is how it should be because various states have different environments and certain studies are required and advance studies encouraged. So, no two states should have identical course studies. What is needed is the primary schools and home school agendas to be equal and from there on in high school speciality courses should be taught. Don't teach farming to city students as a course that is required to graduate - that makes no sense. Now, you get my drift? Common sense is needed before $ spent.
Oh, give me a break! Just because someone is from a "farming state" doesn't mean that they shouldn't study other courses, like economics and business. The "no child left behind" was a failure and it was a farce of equalizing education. You probably believe in the "separate but equal school of thought" which was prejudiced against Black children, complete with lousy books and materials. There are some people who overcome this with their teaching, but not all and I know as I saw the inferior treatment, even while going to a school in a majority white district. The U.S. will not succeed until all children are afforded the same education. Otherwise, each state should keep it's own money instead of sending it to the Feds to be distributed unequally as has been shown for earmarks to benefit Sarah Palin and family and not the people of Alaska who are suffering, while she gads about in her $180k wardrobe.
Good Reading on "Changes"
Our children were lucky to have great teachers from time go, although we paid for Kindergarten that was not available "free" by the state. We do have problems in adjoining counties where our grandsons go to school. So, our children elected and were able to place them in a school of choice. This has worked out great for them and this is one way, if the money were not filtered to the state and each school district could use their tax money as they see fit, just might work. Now, I mean if all School Districts have square (no sticky fingers)type of people and not a little tilted in charge.
Anonymous said on 4/19 that it would not be a waste to have various courses be REQUIRED SUBJECTS (i.e. farming) to graduate in various states. True, this type of teaching is now available over the internet, but the School Districts pay for it and only if there is sufficient students that qualify. There are community colleges in various areas of each state that offer courses that were not available in local High Schools. These courses,if you are taking farming, also include financial courses - not just weed and feed or milk and cheese.
Anonymous said...
Higher Education has always varied State by State. That is how it should be because various states have different environments and certain studies are required and advance studies encouraged. So, no two states should have identical course studies.
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FALSE! Are you still living in the same state on the same street where you grew up? Well, some people move and move again! And, if you were in a "farming" state and you moved to "silicon" state, shouldn't you have been allowed to take courses to cover any type of work that the U.S. offers, and not just one state? What about people in the Armed Forces and their children? They are constantly on the move and luckily for some are exposed to different cultures and education and are not stuck in the mud with a cardboard cutout of a school education in a low income district. It should be equal across the board, not limited according to the wealth of one community vs. another.
Education is different from one school district to another. We are not under any Federal or Dictatorship that says you may only have 28 students in each class, teach reading, writing,math, languages, other than English, Gym and science classes. If you prefer something more to your ability, a Tech. School with transportation is usually provided. These are the basic school requirements throughout the USA. After the 12 grade there is Community Colleges available. There is no excuse for not having a well-rounded education. A student will learn under very poor conditions, if he/she makes the effort and the parents are there to help. Pay attention to your child's education, you only get one chance to make a difference.
Schools and the way the students are taught does vary from state to state. When we were checking the schools in SC and Alabama, where the home office was considering relocating, we were surprised how lacking in the various course studys that are offered here and not down there in the schools. As one poster said courses offered do vary from state to state. If we move, our children will go to a private school & they are affordable down there.
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